Men rushed in New Kingston .... police hold 4

As news and pictures from last night's scene at Trafalgar Square in New Kingston, the same square that was in the news earlier this year and before where homeless msms gather at nights and where a taxi driver had rescued some cross dressers over a year ago. Above see the remnants of a cross dressers outfit left on the scene Reports  from key influentials in and associated with the group suggest that threats have been issued by men in and around New Kingston and from a particular popular supermarket staff who have clashed with some of the homeless populations before by throwing stones and other debris at them while passing and verbally assaulting them. 

Trafalgar square on a sunny day 

Other more serious threats have been issued based on the grapevine where it is said that a kind of fatwa has been declared that one of the homeless men especially the cross dressers must be eliminated by December of this year, repetitive insults have been issued and were said to be on the increase. On my sister blog Gay Jamaica Watch only a few days ago I posted problems with the homeless msms in downtown Kingston and other issues to do with poor frontline advocacy from our representatives.

Last night's episode was said to have commenced around 8pm where the friends had gathered at a particular regular spot, which I have also been to before, they were said to have been pounced upon by passers-by and argument ensued following a brawl followed, police were summoned and unfortunately the queens and their friends were taken to the Half Way Tree police where they have been on holding since last evening, the group tried to explain their situation to the cops but their attempts failed and they were rounded up after things became tense at the spot.

Almost fifteen minutes before the creation of this post I managed to have spoken to one of the men through an influential who informed me that the other three men were already processed but were still held and he was waiting his turn. I deduced from the brief exchange that apparently their more masculine aesthetic/presentation has led to an issue of profiling by the cops as they were deemed suspects in a series of robberies in the New Kingston and Half Way Tree areas recently. Police have been known to frequently stereotype and profile men who supposedly fit a certain gangster description linked to criminal activity generally. Thankfully this one never turned out worse, we wait to see if they will be released. 

an old Jamaica Observer pic/story on homeless msms in 2011

This matter of a lack of interest by our advocates towards this languishing population glaring yet again, as we see however they couldn't care less about this population and almost echo sentiments that come very more contemptuous sections of the LGBT community that they are hopeless and cannot or do not need help. Happenings on the international stage, public relations smooth overs and ceremony are far more important than dealing with lives interrupted when they know fully well that they have access to the cogs of HIV and LBGT advocacy funding which can go a far way in helping to assist these sometimes aimless, low self esteemed, displaced or homeless men. The repealing of the buggery law is inextricably linked to this issue whether we want to believe it or not.

also see the hypocrisy on homelessness in the MSM community


The dark side to the homeless issue ..............

and 

Doing 'business' in New Kingston ... Jamaica Observer on MSM Homelessness ..... JFLAG should be ashamed

MEN RUSHED AND BEATEN IN NEW KINGSTON

SHOTS FIRED AT HOMELESS GAYS IN KINGSTON, HOMELESS SITUATION SPIRALING OUT OF CONTROL

MSMS RESCUED BY TAXI DRIVER

HOMELESS MSMS HARRASSED ON STREETS BY POLICE

this was the spot across from the park that this CVM TV report was made earlier this year

The rest of us feel almost helpless and angered in a sense as our little private informal crisis interventions cannot dent the problems associated with this issue as it requires far more professional help and psycho social work, some of the men have been assisted by concerned influentials who have literally housed them in their home but the sash as shown struned on the ground in the pic above was owned by one of the Miss World LGBT 2011 contestants who in my view had no business on the streets with that article of the event. 

Also on November 14, 2011 I also posted recent concerns and issues with other displaced men on sister blog Gay Jamaica Watch:

Homelessness/Displacement problems again .........

Only two days ago November 16 we had International Day of Tolerance where I raised my continued concern for this population: 

International Day for Tolerance 16.11.11 my concerns of our state by glbtqja3

Peace and tolerance

H

Church will not compromise on homosexuality (Observer Letter)

As the silly season as I call it is on again on us as is whenever homosexuality makes the mainstream news we see misinformed misconstrued arguments damning supposed imposing homosexuals to hell just because (this time) there is agitation for consensual buggery to be opened up. It is very interesting that these holy luminaries never extend an invitation to attend church then or commune with the saints then seeing we are so sinful and need redemption.

Isn't the churches role to win souls for the kingdom whoever and whatever sins that soul has is of no importance?

Have a read of the letter from the Observer:

Church will not compromise on homosexuality

Dear Editor,

At times one has to look beyond achievements and positions in a person's life to debunk their arguments. For example, take this quote from Sir Ronald Sanders' column in the November 13 Sunday Observer on the subject of homosexuals' rights in the Caribbean. "Caribbean governments face serious difficulties over this issue. There is a strong prejudice in societies based on both a lack of education and reluctance to engage the issue in public fora. The Churches in the Caribbean are the most unyielding, constraining political parties from adopting a more enlightened and modern-day view of the matter." Is this a matter of facts or only the highly esteemed gentleman's opinion? I am sure there is nothing wrong if someone is prejudiced to something that is considered wrong.

In Sir Ronald's opinion, Caribbean people lack education. That's an insult to the moral intelligence of our people. No one is burning homosexuals at the stake. The dictates of our conscience tell us it is wrong to practise homosexuality because it's against the enduring moral law of God. Maybe the belief in the Creator isn't something that goes well with this enlightened gentleman. We who are of the household of faith have no hesitation to believe that God's words are eternal and truthful. The church's mandate is to preach the good news of the gospel, which is to tell the world about the saving grace that's found when you believe in the atoning work of Jesus on the cross. The Bible also warns that practising homosexuals will not be a part of God's kingdom. Should the church compromise to please modern or post-modern view on homosexuality? The church of Jesus Christ will never bow to any such pressure, because we serve the true and living God. We love the homosexual sinners and pray that they will atone for their sins, but embracing the act would be like playing Russian roulette with your eternal soul. The talk of money and aid from developed countries is just a bait for us to be trapped in this morass of deviant behaviour. Let us cast off all vestige of master and servants and stand as a united people, willing to chart our own course in this world and let no one enslave our minds.

In Sir Ronald's opinion, Caribbean people lack education. That's an insult to the moral intelligence of our people. No one is burning homosexuals at the stake. The dictates of our conscience tell us it is wrong to practise homosexuality because it's against the enduring moral law of God. Maybe the belief in the Creator isn't something that goes well with this enlightened gentleman. We who are of the household of faith have no hesitation to believe that God's words are eternal and truthful. The church's mandate is to preach the good news of the gospel, which is to tell the world about the saving grace that's found when you believe in the atoning work of Jesus on the cross. The Bible also warns that practising homosexuals will not be a part of God's kingdom. Should the church compromise to please modern or post-modern view on homosexuality? The church of Jesus Christ will never bow to any such pressure, because we serve the true and living God. We love the homosexual sinners and pray that they will atone for their sins, but embracing the act would be like playing Russian roulette with your eternal soul. The talk of money and aid from developed countries is just a bait for us to be trapped in this morass of deviant behaviour. Let us cast off all vestige of master and servants and stand as a united people, willing to chart our own course in this world and let no one enslave our minds.

Ray G Stennett
ray4rs2000@aol.com

ENDS

I will try to respond via email and also send the writer my audio commentary on the legality so to speak of homosexuality:

 Homosexuality is Not Illegal in Jamaica .... Buggery is despite the persons gender 12.11.11 by glbtqja6 

Clearly as I have been repeating we, the LGBT community have serious misconceptions about what is legal versus what is being asked for. And to think homosexuality is always held up as the worse sin above all others, why is that?

The six or so passages that speak against homosexuality were never said by God or Jesus himself and for all we know we don't have any other passages at this time in the present version of the Bible or what may have been left out by the Council of Nicea in Rome when they were putting the first draft of the good book together . When Constantine Emperor then in Rome when this council was put together entered the church it was not as a penitent seeking God’s grace. He entered as the "Pontifex Maximus," Chief Religious Ruler. The faithful bishops were divested of authority when they did not consent to what Constantine ultimately decided was correct or usable for the empire. Truth was not the criteria.

What Constantine wanted was a united front for his new found state religion. He had plenty of division and divisiveness under the pagan rule with three thousand gods.
He wanted a united front to parade before the nation and was ready to cast out from religious authority all that would not bow the knee to his decisions. Hence bishops such as Arius and his associates were put down and lost voice in the spiritual heavens as they were "cast" to "the earth."

Who is the "third part"? We are schooled in fractions and in our schooling one-third denotesa proportional part of a whole. Scripture does not fit into that mold. In Zechariah 13:8, 9 we read: "And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the Lord, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.

"And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people."

In other words judge not! and do not use the word to conveniently suit your own gains. Let the spirit guide you, if we are to be with him (God) then so be it, let him be our final judge. If we are to deal with this issue it's going to take level heads, if the writer is worried about outward displays of affection the culture will fix that, if we are worried about paedophilia mistakenly thought committed from adult male homosexuals then more enlightenment is required on the writer's part. The vast number of gay/bi males in Jamaica are disinterested in children or little boys and are more nurturing if one just asks without any moves to inappropriate sexual contact with a minor, NOT all same sex paedophilia cases are committed by same sex attracted men, in fact most perpetrators as we are told by the experts are heterosexual with deeper psychological scarring from some episode in their past that translates into sexual activity with prepubescent persons with the motivator being control and the dominance over a victim who offers the least resistance.

For an adult of any orientation to have sexual desire for children that is a diagnosable disorder homosexuality with the necessary remedies on the other hand is not the same and not categorised as a disorder since 1973.

Peace and tolerance

H 

Shirley Richards & The Jamaican UK Foster Parents (The Johns) on Love 101 FM ............. on buggery

Mr and Mrs Johns (Above) had said they could not tell a child homosexuality was an acceptable 'lifestyle'

A Christian couple opposed to homosexuality had lost a battle over their right to become foster carers earlier this year in the UK.

Eunice and Owen Johns, 62 and 65, from Derby, both Jamaicans who moved to the UK said the city council did not want them to look after children because of their traditional views.

The pair, who are Pentecostal Christians, say they were "doomed not to be approved". they appeared alongside Lawyers' Christian Fellowship spokesperson anti sodomy laws decriminalization advocate Shirley Richards. The topic of discussion aired on the Love FM 101 weekly program sponsored by the Jamaica Theological Seminary was the recent comment and or threat by the United Kingdom Prime Minister David Cameron on the withdrawal of aid to countries who do not remove or repeal anti sodomy/buggery laws on their books.

Miss Eunice Johns one half of a Jamaican couple who have lived in the United Kingdom for just over forty years said that the couple wanted to continuing running their foster care activity while they were full time employed in total they fostered around fifteen children from the early nineties. They had another business outside of that which was short lived so in 2006 the couple decided to foster care as a business but when they went to sign up and go through the legal wranglings they were naive to the sexual orientation law, " ...we didn't know there was a sexual orientation act ...." she continued " we were so naive and so is a lot of Christians, we seem to think that politics has nothing to do with us, well politics has everything to do with us because its affecting us as parents, we applied to foster just to be told we had to go the line of an assessment and while we were going down there was a question, no it wasn't a question it was a scenario, they the, the social worker er um put a scenario to us she said, what if a child of eight comes to you and tell you they were homosexual what would you tell them? so I said I don't think a child of eight would know their sexuality but they said yes, so I said well I couldn't tell a child of eight that it is alight to be homosexual, she said you would have to, you would have to tell children it's alright to be homosexual because these issues that children has when you do not explain to them what is happening and then it can mess them up later life. 

So I said morally and spiritually as a Christian I couldn't tell a child it's alright to be homosexual and we left it there, but this social worker was dominant that she really wanted me to say that it's alright, she even told us that even if we got through the foster care we couldn't take the children to church, we couldn't take them to church either so that's another thing and we have to tell them it's alright, so later on we decided then we didn't want that social worker anymore because we didn't like the route this was going, cause we didn't know there was a sexual orientation act, she told us later on of course and so we went to a panel and the panel, we told the panel our story that as Christians we can foster children but we cannot tell them it's alright to be homosexual cause we don't believe it ourselves so we would be telling a lie and then said, they thanked us for coming and then later on it was about two weeks later we got a letter saying thank you for withdrawing your application."


Mr. Johns was asked to add to the above and he continued that he felt bad after looking after three generations he explained how the fostering worked, He said when the orientation matter was raised he said although they were bible believing Christians they would have worked with the social worker however the law was brought in through the back door in 2006.

Shirley Richards past President of the Lawyers' Christian Fellowship, LCF when asked about her point of view she began by saying that people were clamoring to do what they want to do in the privacy of their bedrooms but the host interjected that the current Prime Minister Andrew Holness said that what happens in private has public effects to which Miss Richards agreed: 

"Absolutely, it is naive to think that is all that is wanted, in every country and you know we have one learned QC (Lord Anthony Gifford) who mentioned Ireland that in Ireland um the anti sodomy laws were repealed by his interventions but the same very thing is happening in Ireland in every country in which these laws have been repealed what has happened is that um Christians are being impacted and so for example in the United Kingdom the Catholics have had to close down their adoption agencies (host interjects - "cause they are against the whole thing of telling children ...") what I find interesting about the Johns that they didn't realize the world around them was changing until they came in contact with the system. (host - "so the system can be very big? so you realize that Christians in Jamaica and outside of and not only Christians but others who are necessarily for if they are not aware of what is happening the thing can come on us overnight and you don't even know")

Eunice Johns agreed: "it came to England overnight, we didn't realize cause we had fostered before we had fostered 15 children we didn't know about the new sexual orientation act."

The host of the program before going to the break set up the stage for the discussion hinting to the effects on countries who have "legalized homosexuality" she also tried to present a tolerance card by saying "we are not talking about people shouldn't have their rights, we not going against people who shouldn't have their rights but what would legalization do in Jamaica, would it prevent the paedophiles from buggering our little boys?"

After the break it was instructive to hear the host of the program mention in a question she posed describing us as "The homosexuals" and "The Gays and lesbians" she said that persons were touting for the legalization of homosexuality. She again after the break repeated her stance on her version of tolerance, "I just want to make it very clear here we are not by any chance saying that if anybody knows of anybody who is involved in homosexuality they should be destroyed, they should be beaten, they should be mobbed, I've had to work with persons like that," Shirley Richards concurred "In fact we want to say that that type of response is absolutely wrong (host - "exactly") and we want to condemn it" (host - "if you know of anybody at all it is not in your right to call out for anything and want to make that very clear.") Ms Richards ended "Absolutely" The host continued in saying she lectures on mental issues and she drew inference to suicides, mental problems, HIV/AIDS high incidence and relationship problems in the same gender loving community in countries where homosexuality is legalized.

Mrs. Shirley Richards answered the following: "....one point I need to make though is that what our law penalises is anal penetration, you know, it's sodomy which is penalised by our laws in Jamaica, there is no law saying, you nuh the law just goes straight to that."

The host however either not understanding what was pointed out by Miss Shirley or that was a gratuitous move repeated a question posed before imputing that homosexuality is illegal, "Would legalizing homosexuality prevent paedophiles, because I've heard the report on the news the victims support unit that many of the little boys age 12 years old they need therapy, would would legalizing this stop anything like that?"

Shirley Richards responds: "I can't see why, I can't say that there is any direct correlation between the repeal of that law and a lessening in the incidence of abuse of minors, I can't see why, I can't see that logically that would follow, I really can't see it, what is needed is for these people, these men to be brought to justice, you know as you mentioned there is still a problem in these countries, look um there is a football coach who was who was, who was fired from his job what was it? at University of Pennsylvania, you know in a country in which there is no sodomy law, there are no sodomy laws in the states of the US and um just recently just a couple days ago he was found guilty of having molested a number of children over the years so to say that if you repeal the buggery law that the incidence of child abuse in this particular area would go down I can't see that that would necessarily follow because it still happens in these countries in which there is no such law."

The host posed a question to the Johns who were present in studio as well: "Mr & Mrs Johns would it then mean like in Britain a man can marry a man a woman can marry a woman then who would have the children? (all laughing) Mrs Johns: "yes I know" Mr. Johns: "It's happening already, a law is coming like Elton John for instance, you know." (host - "so women soon can't find husbands,come let's talk") Mrs. Johns continued: "well yes that what happen and the Bible says go out and replenish two men cannot do that neither can two women so you know that where we know it's wrong, it is wrong the Bible tells us first and foremost that it is wrong, alot of people sometimes say that this is old testament it tells you quire clearly in the new testament that it is wrong for two man to sleep together, two men and two women to sleep together, you know cause you cannot have children, two men cannot have children and two women cannot have children."

Shirley Richards interjects: "You know what too Mrs. White (the host's name called for the first time) what they need to explain to Jamaica David Cameron needs to explain to the Jamaican people you see is why is it HIV/AIDS is still, is out of control (host - "in the countries in which...yes yes") in those countries .. maybe they need to reinstate the law (host - "France has one of the highest cases of HIV where it has been legalized for so many years") among that population among the msm population, the highest incidence."

The host, one Mrs. Blossom White asked if could we suffer and loose financial aid if we don't legalize it in Jamaica? Mr. Johns replied: "That's the problem is the government going to hear the British law? (host- "yes yes") aah if they do and the cutting of funds that means they are open for all kinds of things .. and the Bible say in Leviticus 8 that it is abomination." The host continued that the present Prime Minister that people's private actions have public effects. Miss Richards responds: "Let me tell you why (host - 'yes yes") let me give you an example of that over two years we spent approximately $594 million I think it was on just prevention of HIV/AIDS, you understand? in a country which is strapped for cash and this is just prevention you know, 594 over a two year period, when you look at it the doctors have said anal sex anal penetration ids the most efficient way of passing on the HIV/AIDS virus, shouldn't we then be warning these people against these types of activity? eeeh (host - "..and the mental pressure")

In closing the host asked the guests to give their final words:

Mr Johns: "Be more opened minded and make sure you know what's happening in the world because these are laws being brought in the back door and you just find about these things happening until the challenges, you need to be more aware."

Mrs. Johns: "As Christians out there as people in Jamaica be ye very careful because we in England alot of us as Christians sort of sit and says it doesn't affect us but it affect all of us in the end and whenever you go to get a job or anything like this so many people in jobs in England they cannot speak out against homosexuality, we were fortunate we didn't have a job, we were retired people and we could speak but there are so many people that have been muzzled in the job places, so be very careful and Christians stand up for what you believe in, stand up like the three Hebrew boys, stand up and say God will deliver." Mr. Johns intervened: " ...and we are not into gay bashing (host - "no we not we not destroying anybody, that is their right as it were.") don't go out there and do things, you know?

Shirley Richards: "Yes I would say to Jamaicans just find the ways of letting the government know of your disapproval with the repeal of the buggery laws"

Prayer by Mr. Johns ............ program ends

So we see folks we have a long way to go it seems with old misconceptions and confusing paedophilia related to us is still ripe in the minds of the traditional Christian community and some members of the legal profession.

Peace and tolerance

H

We Got hate mail ............. and an opposing article from Shirley

The Gleaner gave us a weekend treat with two anti gay posturings with one from the leading voice of The Lawyers' Christian Fellowship, LCF Miss Shirley RIchards. Have a read of them both below and see what you make of them.

We Must Reject UK's Dictates

THE EDITOR, Sir:

Reaction to British Prime Minister David Cameron's threat to withhold assistance from countries that fail to legalise homosexuality seems focused on whether or not existing buggery laws should be repealed.

This completely misses the critical issue, which is not whether Jamaica's buggery laws should be repealed, but rather should we allow any other country to impose its culture, values and lifestyle choices on us or dictate terms to us because we need aid.

Implications of giving in to such external arm-twisting are far-reaching and go beyond concerns of national pride and independence, important though those are. It severely curtails our ability to adopt policies or take decisions that Jamaicans consider best in the context of local circumstances and use of available resources, as well as what is acceptable, based on our culture, values and lifestyles.

Conceding to this threat can lead to demands to abolish the death penalty; conform to European standards regarding prison facilities/care; or other such idiosyncrasies. The need to improve conditions in prisons is conceded, but this cannot be merely to conform to standards in affluent countries, but rather must consider local factors, e.g., improving education, health care; or striking a proper balance between what is spent on offenders as against provisions to support youth who have not ran afoul of the law.

Skewed view of democracy

Cameron's threat says much about his and the Western world's concept of democracy. Clearly, in their view, only the peoples of the Western world have rights to democratic choice. The only democratic right possessed by other people is to conform to or agree with the dictates imposed by Western countries. How else could he, with great moral rectitude, consider it appropriate to impose his dictates on other countries, irrespective of the views or the consent of the peoples of those countries?

I personally have a very strong aversion to homosexuality. Nonetheless, I do not support criminalising the actions of consenting adults in privacy or subjecting individual homosexuals to personal hostility and discrimination, or allowing this factor to affect personal relationships.

However, I strongly oppose efforts to sanctify this lifestyle, by asserting its moral acceptability.

KEITH MILLER

Kingston 6

ENDS

and

Jamaica Must Not Surrender Sovereignty

Shirley Richards,

Not being satisfied with the failure of the Commonwealth heads of government to arrive at a consensus on the matter of the repeal of sodomy laws within the Commonwealth, British Prime Minister David Cameron has taken the decision to withhold British aid from non-compliant nations.

Did we hear right, or were we mistaken? Is it true that our former masters are now calling on us to repeal laws that they are not in agreement with, or face the penalty? Is it that somewhere in the 1962 Jamaica (Constitution) Order in Council which facilitated our independence, there remains a hidden, residual power for Britain and its allies to manipulate our legislature as it thinks fit? What did Gandhi, Nkrumah, Manley and others fight for?

The effrontery of David Cameron and his allies is incredulous! (Incidentally, If Eric Williams were around, he surely would have made it clear to members of the Commonwealth that 43 from 54 leaves nought!) Thankfully, however, the very system which the British left us contained within it the right to resistance. That very same philosophy was the driving force of the struggle for the independence of America - government depends on the consent of the governed.

As has been many times said before, the retention of the buggery law provides guidance to us as a country between that which is acceptable and that which is not, in terms of sexual behaviour. It is the legal underpinning of the survival of the tradition of the heterosexual family. It is a guide to parents, children and to our public officials in the matter of sexual affairs. How could the homosexual lifestyle be in the interest of humanity when it leads to nothingness and is fraught with dangers both for the individual and the society?

HIV transmitting out of control

What makes the effrontery worse is that the scientific literature has indicated that in Europe generally "HIV transmission seems to be out of control in the MSM population". If David Cameron was really interested in our welfare, wouldn't he be urging us, with tears in his eyes, not to repeal our laws, as it would appear that by liberalising their laws Britain and its allies have made a grave error?

What is also of grave concern is that in these countries where the laws have been liberalised, there seems to be an emerging tyranny which penalises any expression of dissent of the lifestyle, even where such dissent is expressed privately. Just last month in England, father-of-two, Adrian Smith, 54, was found guilty of misconduct by the Trafford Housing Trust and had his salary slashed by £14,000 after saying on his private Facebook page that same-sex weddings in churches would be "an equality too far".

Neil Addison, an expert in religious discrimination law and a practising barrister in England, commented on this case, saying: "When I was a child, people in England used to say, 'I can say what I like, it's a free country.' That is certainly no longer the case in Britain today."

It's a very similar situation with the abortion issue. On November 15, an employment tribunal in London will begin to hear the case of Margaret Forrester, who was sacked from her job as a mental-health worker because she had shown a pro-life booklet to colleagues that said women suffer from mental-health consequences after abortions.

It is also expected that by December 5, the British Government will lift the ban on same-sex civil-partnership ceremonies in churches. (This was what Adrian Smith was concerned about). Equalities Minister Lynne Featherstone is insisting that churches would have the freedom to decide if they want to offer same-sex services. However, the fear is that even if the scheme was initially voluntary, churches that do not agree to offer the services are "likely to be put under huge pressure to change their policy by campaign groups".

Not tolerated

With all due respect to Lord Gifford, QC, the situation seems to be the same in Ireland. At the time sodomy was decriminalised in 1995, it was argued by the homosexual lobby that they simply wanted to be left alone. However, since then, the lobby has grown into 'a rights industry', and now any criticism or even questioning of them and their continuous demands is not tolerated.

On Sunday, October 30, journalist Eamon Delaney, writing in Ireland's leading newspaper, the Irish Independent, referred to the "insatiable demands" of the homosexual advocates "for more and more recognition and identity". Mr Delaney expressed the concern that this will "eventually alienate mainstream opinion." http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/loud-and-proud-gays-want-to-take-over-rest-of-society-2920975.html.

It is just a matter of time before persons who hold contrary views on both the issue of homosexuality and abortion will have to flee Europe and the United States in search of safe haven. (Déjà vu?)

At the same time, however, one wants to make it abundantly clear that use of violence against homosexuals is absolutely wrong and must be denounced. All allegations of violence, including violence against homosexuals, must be thoroughly investigated by our security forces with the aim of bringing perpetrators to justice.

So up, you mighty nation! Have you forgotten who you are? You are Jamaicans, for goodness sake! Within your laws as they currently are is the key for the preservation of the family, the health of nations and the survival of the human race. So do not be ashamed! Do not be intimidated! You are on solid healthy ground!

Email feedback to sprichards@cwjamaica.com.


my two cents in audio 

   Homosexuality is Not Illegal in Jamaica .... Buggery is despite the persons gender 12.11.11 by glbtqja6 

Homosexuals and buggery law

A group of young men who were described as homosexuals escaped a severe beating last month when some men began chasing them in downtown Kingston.

The young men had to run for their lives when their attackers told them to leave the area because they were encouraging schoolboys to be homosexuals. Women also joined in and began cursing the young men and described them as being very dangerous to the society.

One of the men commented that he overheard discussions on the radio that the British prime minister had threatened to cut off aid to countries that do not uphold human rights, including the oppression of gays and lesbians.

"I am not saying that people should abuse them, but my fear is that they have no right to indoctrinate the young schoolboys or lure them into sexual activities," one of the men said.

He said he was aware that people had sexual preferences but warned that "homosexuals must keep their activities to themselves and be discreet about it".

"Yes, they have no right to come out here looking young schoolboys to spoil them," a woman said.

"I observe gay men forcing themselves on the schoolboys all the time and are even offering them money," the woman added.

"I will beat them if I see them bringing arguments to schoolboys," the man said.

"Although I am definitely against homosexuals, I am not going to break down a house and interfere with two consenting adults. Once they are in the privacy of their home, they should not be disturbed, but if I see them soliciting schoolboys on the street then they must be beaten," the man said.

The recent announcement by the British prime minister has led to groups in Jamaica calling for the government to repeal the buggery law. Some Jamaicans are opposed to the abolition and have pointed out that even if the Government is minded to repeal it, there should be no accommodation for same-sex marriages or unions.

The Jamaica Forum for Lesbians, All Sexuals and Gays ( J-FLAG) said recently that "It is clear that as a country we can no longer ignore the suffering of hundreds of thousands of Jamaicans who are lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender. J-FLAG stands ready to support the Government in demonstrating its commitments to protect and promote the human rights of all Jamaicans, regardless of their socio-economic status, sexual orientation, health status, disability, work, and political and religious persuasions."

It is against the law for persons to attack or beat homosexuals and they can be arrested and charged. If homosexuals are caught breaking the law, then the matter should be reported to the police for them to investigate the matter and make arrests, if necessary.

Buggery is proven or supposed to be done so by a physical examination by a doctor on behalf of the arresting officer so as to generate a doctor's report; it must find and state as far as I know certain natural and man made substances must be found near or on the anal orifice. Just simply seeing persons and profiling them or seeing them in a copulative position is not enough. Also the sphincter muscle must be shown to be loose by some intrusion; problem however is the lack of an ability to challenge such reports which can be construed so easily.

Think on these things.

also see more posts on Buggery Law matters on Gay Jamaica Watch HERE newer posts will appear first so scroll to view older ones.

H 

Marcus Garvey People's Political Party MGPPP anti IMF/Govt Policy/UK Buggery decriminalization demand protest

Yesterday November 10, 2011 a small peaceful demonstration was launched by the Marcus Garvey People's Political Party MGPPP around 3pm just by the intersection of Knutsford Boulevard and Trafalgar Roads nearing the British High Commission building. Due to the limits placed on public gatherings nearing or beside overseas consulates and Embassies they had to remain away from the entrance. Their main bone of contention as the signs photoed below show was the debt crisis and the IMF International Monetary Fund with the supposed pressure we are under with the latest tests results or lack thereof, public sector job cuts. 


However the UK's pressure to decriminalize the Buggery Law by the withdrawal of aid threat as was proposed by their Prime Minister David Cameron were added to the agenda via the repeated shouts over a bullhorn that was rotated amongst the four man one woman team. They stayed on message for better part of the twenty minutes or so I was there.

this placard holder while having no signs speaking to buggery shouted "No Buggering"  and others who rotated the bullhorn demanded that the PM do not repeal or give in the UK pressure for the Buggery Law's reformation. The other Rastafarian below also chanted anti gay slogans intermittently. 

I sought a brief audience about the issue to do with the buggery law and a man of part Chinese extraction and who seemed to be the organizer of the activity and I had an exchange. He pointed out that we should continue the occupy Jamaica moves as launched before and that the country is in serious debt while we may not have money to pay government workers a sentiment recently expressed by opposition representative Peter Bunting, however it was rebutted by Finance Minister Audley Shaw two days ago that there are enough funds to carry us until the next budget due in March 2012. 


He stressed that Buggery was wrong and unafrican and that we should not give in to foreign pressure and that Marcus Garvey would not have approved. He said we should default on our debt obligations to multi-laterals and development our local sectors before paying a cent over. When I asked what about the penalties for defaulting he said they would just have to understand, a similar sentiment was expressed by the occupy Half Way Tree protest recently where anti gay former talk show host Betty Ann Blaine chained herself to the guard rails by the bus bay. (see video below) The MGPPP demonstrators continued as I left for work, other passers-by took photos as well and collected their pamphlet which outlined a graph of debt we supposedly owe and other pointers about their party in brief exchanges as well. The Rastafarian personalities in the group were a bit uncultured in my view in engaging myself and my friend who accompanied me to the site but they no words like battyman or sodomite were said to our faces, they seemed to be more focused on reaching the motorists in line by the traffic lights as they darted in between cars handing out pamphlets and chanting loudly.

Interestingly in her speech about inequality she never qualified in her explanation if LGBT rights or recognition were apart of that or what she thought about the call for the decriminalization of buggery.


I am expecting more spontaneous protests like this one on the plethora of issues that seem to be on the minds of many and with the visible success of the Occupy Wall Street and our versions of the Occupy phenomenon  persons are finding ways to vent. We can also seek to engage them peacefully and start or continue the respective dialogue on specifically LGBT issues with particular emphasis on sexual orientation and the buggery law's repulsion or decriminalization.


Freedom speech in full effect in Jamaica and good that the brief audience was interactive.


Peace and tolerance


H 

The following is a letter to the Gleaner and my two cents 

Holness Dithering On Homosexuality

THE EDITOR, Sir:

I READ your rather detailed and eloquent editorial of the November 8, and wish to respond to same.

While some may argue that Mr Andrew Holness' ascendancy to the post of prime minister is new, I do not believe that this precludes him from being able to adequately address the issues of homosexuality and our antiquated buggery laws. However, having seen his interview with Ian Boyne on Television Jamaica's programme, Profile, it is evident that any view, or lack there of, that he may express on the subject will be dictated by political expediency.

In his effort to satisfy our bilateral and multilateral partners, the prime minister was quick to assert that he is a libertarian on the equality side, and that Jamaica must meet its human-rights obligations as mandated by the United Nations and the several conventions to which we are signatories. Mr Holness, however, dithered on the issue of repealing the buggery law in his attempt to appease the local electorate.

He made blanket statements about civil rights in the Constitution and some cryptic utterance about expanding civil rights and economic growth. He added that Jamaica's fledgling democracy must be respected and that although it may take longer, the nation has demonstrated through Parliament that it is capable of making difficult decisions regarding social changes.

Wasted opportunity

I would welcome, however, proof that Mr Holness himself cannot only make difficult decisions, but also give direct answers to difficult questions. In attempting to obfuscate the issues, he squandered a wonderful opportunity to let both the nation and our international partners know where he stands on the issue of homosexuality and our archaic buggery laws.

The prime minister cannot serve two masters, and whereas he was more cautious in his pronouncements than Mr Golding's intolerant rants on the British Broadcasting Corporation, he deliberately failed to answer the questions posited to him. One hallmark of a great leader is one willing to let his voice be heard above those of the masses, and not have it drowned out in the chorus. He should not be afraid to lead and have the rest of his Cabinet, political party and the nation, follow; even more so, as we prepare for an election and candidates will be tempted to use the issue to score political mileage.

Already, one member of the Jamaica Labour Party (JLP), Mayor Charles Sinclair, has uttered anti-homosexual remarks as he pandered to scores of party supporters in Montego Bay on the weekend. He indicated that the People's National Party has committed to the principles of dialogue,education and tolerance in respect to "dem odda man" and "mi nuh inna it".

Rather than keeping his views on the topic to himself, he excited the crowd by his intolerance for the sake of scoring cheap political points. As prime minister and the designated leader of the the JLP, I anticipate Mr Holness' swift reaction to Mr Sinclair's remarks, which have presented a golden opportunity for Mr Holness to now display that he can in fact respond to difficult situations and truly lead by example.

Nate Long

natelong88@gmail.com

ENDS

My point of view 

While I agree to a lesser extent the tone of this letter and the fact that the question posed to the Prime Minister on the television program "Profile" hosted by Ian Boyne 

I still contend however this debate is or was too premature on the strength of a supposed threat by British Prime Minister David Cameron to withhold aid to Commonwealth countries that still have the buggery law on their books. Problem is he never named any but it was assumed it would be African states more so due to the upsurge in anti gay activity such as the Ugandan anti gay bill which we are told is supported by big conservative interests in the United States in a form of exportation of hate.

also see:  Intersections of Church and State where the connections are shown in a documentary on the issue

I would have felt more comfortable in the resolve of our rebuttals that we knew definitively that we would loose such aid and precisely why as it goes to a vital rehabilitation project as we were told by the Minister of National Security Dwight Nelson, he said on Nationwide radio recently that the particular aid went to run programs in the correctional facilities and assisted deportees to blend into general society after returning home.

More here in audio from a story published by the Gleaner entitiled "Not Ready for Gays"

On The UK Aid Removal and Holness's Reponse ........ 06.11.11 by glbtqja6

also see my report on a previous discussion on Live @ 7 

CVM TV's Live @ 7 on the UK AID Withdrawal threat & responses .......

Also see more responses from the aforementioned persons and State Minister Miss Malahoo Forte on sister blog Gay Jamaica Watch Reactions continue to come in on the UK's stance on AID to anti gay laws hosting nations

Ironically a letter was published in the same letter today entitled  

Against Gleaner's Pro-Gay Campaign

THE EDITOR, Sir:

I stand in solidarity with all those who are in opposition to the gay lifestyle in Jamaica. The editor of The Gleaner seems to be actively engaging in gay-rights lobby of late. It is sad to see The Gleaner trying to sell to the rest of us the idea that monetary, material and economic progress should be gained by courting the wealth and power of gays, and/or pandering to the wishes of powerful nations like Britain.

I would hope that The Gleaner, the leading newspaper in this our little island home, Jamaica, will not sell out itself, but will stand firm for normal family values, and for moral rectitude, no matter the pressure from abroad or at home!

The world, indeed, is in need of men (and women) who will not be bought or sold, but it does seem that The Gleaner's 'pet' argument is to appeal to the financial gain to be had by Jamaica slowly, but surely, casting off the 'shackles' of sexual decency and normality.

I remind you, Mr Editor, that morals in Jamaica are deeply entrenched in the Christian culture (even if very many of us ignore that reality, or fail to live by its standards). This entrenched cultural reality is confirmed each time we sing the national anthem, which is a prayer to the Eternal Father of the Christian tradition, and each time we swear in our leaders and court witnesses using the Bible.

If we don't want God's influence in the affairs in our land, we should also change our national anthem, remove the Bibles from the courtrooms, find some other symbol to swear by, have no devotions in schools, discontinue national prayer breakfasts, etc. It is national hypocrisy to do otherwise and remain consistent!

DERRICK GILLESPIE

St Elizabeth

Certainly we have not heard the end of this matter.
UPDATE November 23 from GLBTQJA Wordpress

Minister confirms UK will redirect aid, not cut it, for human rights violation

Andrew Mitchell (photo) said the policy had been wrongly reported as a threat to cut aid

UK/commonwealth Aid Matter & The New Developments, no aid cuts but redirecting, ethical problems on our part - 22.11.11 

also see: 

NOT READY FOR GAYS ……. GAY MARRIAGE SMOKE SCREEN REINTRODUCED ……………. POLITICAL DODGING

Peace and tolerance

H